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Simon, I am not sure what your obsession is with the Clinton administration but I dont think that anyone else is drawing any kind of connection as to what any of this has to do with Paragon Properties other than attempting to divert the conversation away from their incomplete projects. I dont like Clinton any more than I like Bush but that is besides the point. Please go to a political board if you want to talk politics or seek help if you fail to realize you are off topic in this forum.
FYI – David Murray is one of our Moderators and could be considered ‘forum police’ although I know he doesn’t like the uniforms much.
Scott Oliver – Founder
WeLoveCostaRica.comRipple33- glad to see you joining the trend!
Where to start with you Ripple? If you didn’t notice I am answering a question posed by davidmurray (although of course you know this) and surely it is to him that you should address your question. However since you have given me another opportunity here goes…
You attempt to insult me with comments like “seek help” just because in your mind the subject isn’t related.
I am making a connection between the Clintons ripping people off with their real estate deal and the willingness of voters (no doubt some of those same readers of this forum) to vote for them despite knowing the facts about White Water. These same people are only too happy to go along with the lynch mob in this forum whilst knowing less factual information about the projects here than the evidence they choose to overlook about the Clintons. Correct me if I am wrong but as far as I know there is not one post in this forum from someone who has even claimed to have lost money in a project down here; if only the same could be said of the Clintons deal! The fact that you fail to see the hypocrisy in this says more about you than anything I could say. Perhaps are you suggesting that no one who reads this forum has voted for the Clintons?
…and finally in case you haven’t noticed there are postings in this forum on many subjects and you are the only one to date to suggest that a member take his comments elsewhere and furthermore you are the only one to use insults…nice going! I would suggest that you seek help but I fear there would be little point for you. Scott gave instructions above to be nice; I suggest you follow those instructions.
Edited on Jul 26, 2007 06:17
Simondg, I, too, find it difficult to make the connection between Paragon Properties and your gratuitous slams at the Clintons. I am, however, unashamed of being in the majority of Americans who admire them.
Just for the record, President Clinton was impeached not for having “a fling” with his secretary but for lying about it. Given the circumstances, I suspect many of us would do the same. The summich is human!
George Bush, et al, lied about the justification for invading Iraq, but where is the uproar? Clinton ruined a perfectly good dress. Bush instigated the loss of some 3,400 American military members’ lives, the loss of an untold number of private military contractors, the loss of an uncountable number of innocent Iraqis, and the maiming and dismemberment of ten times as many more. And where is the uproar?
Next time you feel a need to tee off on the Clintons, first ask yourself who is the greater villain. If you want to attack both, that’s fine with me, but do it in the same sentence, eh?
P.S. Scott, Marcia loves me in the uniform.
Just to keep to the “facts” it was in the Sudan at an asprin factory not Syria. Like golf we tend to only remember our bad shots; very few people are all good or bad including politicians. But if you identify very strongly with one group or another this may affect/influence your opinion. All that said there really doesn’t seem to be a need to bring American politics into the equation here, especialy a thread on Paragon?
It is not allowed to build anything without permits and to get them you need a Master Plan for a development….so unless they haven’t broken ground at all, anywhere, they must have this paperwork in order; if someone knows that they don’t have such documents in place for any of their projects let’s hear about it..
If you would go to Welcomeparagon.com and just scan their website a lot of your questions could be answer I am looking to begain construction withen the next 90 days we have put in place a way of checking their progress.
Frank R. Scales
…and so my theory is confirmed – you vote for them despite the fact that you know they ripped people off and yet are quick to judge other people for committing crimes and advise others to avoid doing business with them. It’s not that I disagree with you exactly but I cannot help noting the contradiction (not just you but i’m guessing many others).
Someone in this forum used the expression “if it walks like a duck” etc…when referring to one of these developers; and this seems to be the consensus of opinion. If we use this same approach with the Clintons (clearly a lot of duck like behaviour going on) why would we still support them? On this basis we could vote for the guy from WWLI (if he ran for office) despite his activities!
The evidence against them in White Water is very strong despite the lack of conviction as is the evidence that the Bush team put together the plan for war first and then gathered evidence to justify military action. (in the same sentence!)
It’s good to know the forum police are dressed appropriately..
on the contrary, there is every need to make the connection between two related events. I find human behaviour very interesting and the fact that the Clintons were used as an example is not the point at all.
Individually we wouldn’t condone the acts of a criminal yet the vast majority will make an exception for someone in public office because they believe it is for the common good. It is incredible what people will go along with. In this forum I am the lone voice of descent; not deliberatley but because I am not so arrogant to think that I know everything. I recall very clearly how the U.S public was against France for not going along with the war…remember freedom fries? Today those same people, knowing more of the facts are probably a little embarrased.
P.S. aren’t you being a little pedantic? After all I did say “Syria, or some such place” and does it really matter? The point was the intelligence was wrong, as usual, and the intent was to distract attention from his Lewinsky problems. Again, it looks as if they said who can we bomb? Find a target! He was prepared to take the lives of people on the other side of the world to save his own skin back home.
Frank – please don’t misinterpret my comments, if there is any wrong doing I am on the side of the investor. I do though think it important for the facts to be clarified if the finger is pointed which, after all, lends credibility to this forum, not, as some would seem to indicate, undermines those making complaints.
Hey simondg I’m 100% with you I’ve spent more on lawyers and investigators than I have on properties purchased.
Frank R. Scales
Simondg you seem to have it all figured out…human behavior and all! I think (allowed?) that people vote for the Clinton’s because they may feel that although they are not perfect they do represent some good ideas as well. Of course those that align themselves with people like Chomsky, Zinn or Said won’t find much of anything to like about the Clinton’s. Although I voted for Nader I don’t believe Bill and Hillary were intending to rip folks off with the WW real estate project. I think like anyone else they thought/were told it was a good investment and could make some money? Did Bill really send missiles to the Sudan just to distract the American public, you think yes…your opinion no real way to know unless you have invented a machine that reads hearts and minds. Have you? You really come off as a bit of a pompous armchair intellectual…
I’m surprised at you – continuing to discuss the very subject that you said did not need to be brought into a thread about Paragon. Anyway ignoring that contradiction and at the risk of facing the wrath of nipple33 by continuing a debate on a subject that isn’t in his approved list I will, like you, continue.
No Lotus, it’s precisely because I don’t think I have it all figured out that I take the position that I do. Your answer however seems to back up my point; you are prepared to give the Clintons the benefit of the doubt on both counts in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary whilst going along with the comments herein with only a fraction of the information needed to form an educated opinion. (If you notice, the common theme of my postings is asking for more info; rarely is it offered).
The fact is you are right; I don’t know, or can’t prove that Clinton killed those people in good faith or that the investment scheme that he and his wife ran was not a scam. That his friend would rather go to jail than testify against him would tend to lend credibility to a guilty verdict however let’s go along with your version for now. Again, I don’t know if I’m right and that’s the point; you on the other hand in supporting him have concluded that you know something that you couldn’t possibly know.
Using your reasoning with Clinton and applying the same logic to George Bush and the Iraq fiasco knowing what we now know (fabricated intelligence etc..) one would have to conclude that “although he is not perfect he does have some good ideas as well!”
Thanks for your personal comments; what’s an armchair intellectual? Is it better to be another kind; please advise, I’m not an expert in this area.
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